The old DDM (D&D miniatures) line

[Kaiden | The Gallant Goblin/LPP]

I think we cannot say that Wizkids does detail work worse than the old WotC sets, when THESE are only Common minis yet have super small parts that are really well painted, or have great facial and clothing detail.

D&D-Icons of the Realms-Waterdeep-Dungeon of the Mad Mage-09 - Elf Cleric of the Grave.jpg
D&D-Icons of the Realms-Mythic Odysseys of Theros-05 - Nymph, Lampad03.jpg
D&D-Icons of the Realms-Mythic Odysseys of Theros-10 - Leonin Swiftclaw01.jpg
D&D-Icons of the Realms-Boneyard-09 - Poltergeist.jpg
D&D-Icons of the Realms-Baldur's Gate - Descent into Avernus-10 - Merrenoloth02.jpg
D&D-Icons of the Realms-Fangs & Talons-02 - Kobold Inventor (Scorpion on a Stick)03.jpg
D&D-Icons of the Realms-Fangs & Talons-07 - Skeletal Alchemist01.jpg

Yeah, the biggest problem with Wizkids isn't even the neatness (they've improved on that dramatically over the years), it's the fact they refuse to add washes or highlights to all but a few minis so they just look like definitionless blob of colour.

Doesn't help that they don't use the "Heroic scale" that every other miniature brand on the planet use, where faces and hands/feet are slightly increased in size compared to a true realistic scale so they show up better on the table. I don't care that it's realistic Wizkids, it makes the minis look like indefinable when I'm playing with them and also WHY WOULD I WANT MY PLASTIC TOY SOLDIERS TO LOOK REALISTIC.

[arbados]

Yeah, the biggest problem with Wizkids isn't even the neatness (they've improved on that dramatically over the years), it's the fact they refuse to add washes or highlights to all but a few minis so they just look like definitionless blob of colour.

Doesn't help that they don't use the "Heroic scale" that every other miniature brand on the planet use, where faces and hands/feet are slightly increased in size compared to a true realistic scale so they show up better on the table. I don't care that it's realistic Wizkids, it makes the minis look like indefinable when I'm playing with them and also WHY WOULD I WANT MY PLASTIC TOY SOLDIERS TO LOOK REALISTIC.

I strongly agree with your first point. A simple wash would make the minis look 1000 times better.

However, as for scale I personally don't care for the minis to be "heroic scale" as you outlined. I'm fine with the current size and many of the faces and other details are well enough for tabletop gaming.

[deadsmurf]

...
Doesn't help that they don't use the "Heroic scale" that every other miniature brand on the planet use, where faces and hands/feet are slightly increased in size compared to a true realistic scale so they show up better on the table. I don't care that it's realistic Wizkids, it makes the minis look like indefinable when I'm playing with them and also WHY WOULD I WANT MY PLASTIC TOY SOLDIERS TO LOOK REALISTIC.

I absolutely can't stand heroic scaled minis - oversized hand/feet and heads are the absolutely worst, and I'll never buy minis from a line that includes them regularly.
That was one of the things that drew me to D&D miniatures back in like 2004 after I had enough random minis to represent each size category of monsters - that characters looked semi-realistic. At least proportionally. I would have not switched over the the Pathinder & Icons lines if they didn't continue on that tradition.

Looking up the release dates of Giants of Legends & Aberrations, since I started right between them at some point in the summer, that I've been buying these little guys for 20 years now.

[Kaiden | The Gallant Goblin/LPP]

...
Doesn't help that they don't use the "Heroic scale" that every other miniature brand on the planet use, where faces and hands/feet are slightly increased in size compared to a true realistic scale so they show up better on the table. I don't care that it's realistic Wizkids, it makes the minis look like indefinable when I'm playing with them and also WHY WOULD I WANT MY PLASTIC TOY SOLDIERS TO LOOK REALISTIC.

I absolutely can't stand heroic scaled minis - oversized hand/feet and heads are the absolutely worst, and I'll never buy minis from a line that includes them regularly.
That was one of the things that drew me to D&D miniatures back in like 2004 after I had enough random minis to represent each size category of monsters - that characters looked semi-realistic. At least proportionally. I would have not switched over the the Pathinder & Icons lines if they didn't continue on that tradition.

Looking up the release dates of Giants of Legends & Aberrations, since I started right between them at some point in the summer, that I've been buying these little guys for 20 years now.

Yeah, DDM's characters are fairly realistic (the hands and heads are at least slightly oversized on a few tho, compared to modern Wizkids minis), but like 90% of the monsterous humanoids have heroic scale oversized features, especially orcs and the like... So I assume you don't like those? Not trying to be passive-aggressive or anything, I'm just curious, cause the main reason I started buying up DDM minis myself is cause most of them have slightly cartoony oversized features compared to modern minis; It's the style of the time and I personally love the old school mini look, that's why I collect them.

[Kaiden | The Gallant Goblin/LPP]

Also, here's an unintended benefit of the fact DDM minis are painted with the paint they use on tanks: You can wash them off if they ever get dusty without have to worry about screwing up the paint.!

[BBShockwave]

...
Doesn't help that they don't use the "Heroic scale" that every other miniature brand on the planet use, where faces and hands/feet are slightly increased in size compared to a true realistic scale so they show up better on the table. I don't care that it's realistic Wizkids, it makes the minis look like indefinable when I'm playing with them and also WHY WOULD I WANT MY PLASTIC TOY SOLDIERS TO LOOK REALISTIC.

I absolutely can't stand heroic scaled minis - oversized hand/feet and heads are the absolutely worst, and I'll never buy minis from a line that includes them regularly.
That was one of the things that drew me to D&D miniatures back in like 2004 after I had enough random minis to represent each size category of monsters - that characters looked semi-realistic. At least proportionally. I would have not switched over the the Pathinder & Icons lines if they didn't continue on that tradition.

Looking up the release dates of Giants of Legends & Aberrations, since I started right between them at some point in the summer, that I've been buying these little guys for 20 years now.

Agreed. They kinda look exaggerated, like they are all Firbolgs or something.

[deadsmurf]

Yeah, DDM's characters are fairly realistic (the hands and heads are at least slightly oversized on a few tho, compared to modern Wizkids minis), but like 90% of the monsterous humanoids have heroic scale oversized features, especially orcs and the like... So I assume you don't like those? Not trying to be passive-aggressive or anything, I'm just curious, cause the main reason I started buying up DDM minis myself is cause most of them have slightly cartoony oversized features compared to modern minis; It's the style of the time and I personally love the old school mini look, that's why I collect them.

I'm not a big fan of those figures, though for Orcs and the like, the larger heads was still within the regular art direction of the edition, so the majority are fine. The most grossly cartoony ones were only in Harbinger and Archfiends though, and i kept those to a minimum in my collection

[coyotee]

Anyone know a good place to get the old DDM prepainted minis cases?

Original DDM.

[Kaiden | The Gallant Goblin/LPP]

Anyone know a good place to get the old DDM prepainted minis cases?

Original DDM.

I meant it in more of a descriptive term like you know, those old DDM minis. Also check your DMs again lol.

[Imbalance]

I can somewhat appreciate heroic scale for hand-sculpted minis. There is artistic charm to it. Digital sculpting is better at consistency of proportions while still affording some variety in species sizes for boring old humies, elves, and dwarves. Orcs are monsters, not humans (fight me), and avatars of chaos. They need not be consistent. In fact, it's better that they aren't.

[Rotolord]

Another, often underplayed, great feature af the DDM line was that the vast majority of them are nearly indestructible.

Which, if you use minis to play at the table like I do, means they will survive falling from the table, clumsy players, even curious kids…or cats!

And, moving them around w/o damage is much much easier than with WK lines.

On quality, I agree with the general impression: many good pieces in all sets, but many suckers too, I think in WK lineup overall quality is higher, but with many exceptions.

Sometimes capturing the souls of a D&D creature is an odd thing and many old DDM are still my to go minis. Some WK minis are masterpieces though.

Lastly, let’s not forget that even with a higher % of lower quality minis, at some point there were 8 minis per booster at half current price for 4.

But, those times are gone. For now at least, who knows if in the future technology will see a new competitor rise with better quality AND price.

I doubt it, but one can hope.

[BBShockwave]

I still do find some that have broken weapons, but agreed, on a whole they are less prone to breaking than IotR.
Mage Knight of course, wins out in the fragility contest by a few kilometers.

[Kaiden | The Gallant Goblin/LPP]

Another, often underplayed, great feature af the DDM line was that the vast majority of them are nearly indestructible.

Which, if you use minis to play at the table like I do, means they will survive falling from the table, clumsy players, even curious kids…or cats!

And, moving them around w/o damage is much much easier than with WK lines.

On quality, I agree with the general impression: many good pieces in all sets, but many suckers too, I think in WK lineup overall quality is higher, but with many exceptions.

Sometimes capturing the souls of a D&D creature is an odd thing and many old DDM are still my to go minis. Some WK minis are masterpieces though.

Lastly, let’s not forget that even with a higher % of lower quality minis, at some point there were 8 minis per booster at half current price for 4.

But, those times are gone. For now at least, who knows if in the future technology will see a new competitor rise with better quality AND price.

I doubt it, but one can hope.

Yeah, I agree Wizkids sculpts are on the same level or even higher than DDM, mostly. But what sets them apart is the paint job: (Btw I am a pro painter and a painting competition judge, so this is my jam) DDM minis have vastly superior paint jobs, not in neatness or detail but in the simple fact they use washes and highlights for virtually all the minis, whereas Wizkids only use washes or highlights on a handful of minis per set and the majority are just blobs of colour with no detail or contrast.

[Kaiden | The Gallant Goblin/LPP]

I still do find some that have broken weapons, but agreed, on a whole they are less prone to breaking than IotR.
Mage Knight of course, wins out in the fragility contest by a few kilometers.

Tbh I love the DDM softer plastic just cause the durability, I could probably throw my Bluespawn Godslayer into a brick floor and he’d be fine lol. Idk what they use for paint, but it’s gotta be the same stuff they use on tanks.

[Imbalance]

It's curious to me, but WK has used a softer, DDM-like plastic before. Maybe more than once, but I recall that the HeroClix Avengers set from 2007(?iirc), when they introduced character cards, had very durable figures with very bendy appendages. I'm trying to remember another set, but brain won't brain. I've seen no example of that material in Icons that I could tell.