Wizkids New Bases

[Clint]

I think it makes sense not to include them. Many figures don't need them at all, and I've seen plenty of tables forgo them entirely for many types of creatures (NPCs, animals, fungus, etc). Couple this with the Black vs. Clear preferences, I wouldn't be surprised if over half end up in the bin. I know I've tossed almost all of mine.

I will straight up not buy any Nolzur's that don't come with bases, and I bet I'm not alone. They've already been raising the prices on them - the large ones have mostly doubled in price in the past year or so - and this just seems petty and cheap.

Good for you that you don't need them, but a lot of folks need them. If WK were reducing the price because bases are no longer included, then that's one thing. But they aren't. Instead, it seems obvious that they want to also force customers to pay separately for the bases that used to be included. So this just seems like you are applauding them for once again offering less for more. You save nothing, and plenty of other folks are getting gouged.

I spend thousands of dollars per year on miniatures and terrain. A good chunk of that used to go to WK. Now, barely any of it does, and the reason is that they constantly do BS like this.

[MyriadTabletop]

So this just seems like you are applauding them for once again offering less for more.

Nah. I'm not applauding anyone. I'm saying from a waste perspective I don't mind at all.

- Some people want clear.
- Some people want black.
- Some people want thicker.
- Some people don't use them at all
- Some people use custom bases

So many bases are thrown out, and I like the idea that waste can be reduced and people can just buy according to their needs.

I get the perspective that for the cost Wizkids should include -something-, but we know that Wizkids is gonna charge the same for the figure with or without a base, so I'd just as soon go without rather than have an ever growing waste pile. It's not a defense of Wizkids, just a personal preference really. Not everything is about cost.

Of course, I'd be all for Wizkids reducing the cost on account of the lack of bases, it's just not the world we live in. So given the option, leave 'em out I say.

[berk the black]

So this just seems like you are applauding them for once again offering less for more.

I'm not applauding anyone. I'm saying from a waste perspective I don't mind at all.

- Some people want clear.
- Some people want black.
- Some people want thicker.
- Some people don't use them at all
- Some people use custom bases

So many bases are thrown out, and I like the idea that waste can be reduced and people can just buy according to their needs.

I get the perspective that for the cost Wizkids should include -something-, but we know that Wizkids is gonna charge the same for the figure with or without a free base, so I'd just as soon go without rather than have an ever growing waste pile. It's not a defense of Wizkids, just a personal preference really. Not everything about cost.

Of course, I'd be all for Wizkids reducing the cost on account of the lack of bases, it's just not the world we live in. So given the option, leave 'em out I say.

I agree, decoupling the bases from the mini is best for me. It is easier for me to pick up black bases and use them than to paint the clear bases black.

[Clint]

Okay, *but what about other people*? Including no base screws everyone over and helps no one.

Case in point, I just got the flail snail for X-mas. The miniature is fantastic. No base, and I don't have an extra huge base. I prefer the clear ones, and they are not easy to get. So to me that feels like a big "FU" from Wizkids. Now I have to figure out a base for it, but one thing I can tell you is that it won't be from them. I think I'm done with Wizkids. I can get better miniatures cheaper from companies who aren't constantly trying to find new ways to gouge me.

Edit: For X-mas, I received miniatures from Steamforged, Reaper, and Wizkids. Only one of them came sans base.

[Brophy]

I'm with Clint on this topic.

Removing bases from an existing product line is BS.

I've grown so sour to wizkids over the last year it's become very easy to buy elsewhere.

[MyriadTabletop]

Including no base screws everyone over and helps no one.

If all you mean by "screwing everyone over" is that people who were satisfied with the included bases now have to spend an extra $0.35 on an aftermarket base that suits their preferences.... then sure. Those devils.

But for those of us (of which there are many) who never used the wafer thin biscuits (for any number of reasons), you have to understand that the intense language over this feels a little silly. I'm sorry your Flail Snail didn't come with a base if you expected one, that's probably annoying. But objectively speaking you're in the same position that hundreds of us who insist on non-stock base options are already in, and I promise we get by just fine. I'll laser-cut you a few 2mm clear acrylic bases and pop-em in the mail if you like, no trouble.

[SkyDomer]

I am with Clint on this not including bases is really annoying especially on huge and small minis where those bases tend to be annoying to get. I buy a lot of Nolzur minis if anyone visits the mini painting thread they can see that I use the Wizkids bases. I also prefer to try to keep my bases matching and getting Wizkids bases tends to be annoying as others have already pointed out in this thread. If Wizkids does chose to continue down this path of not including bases I will likely buy a lot less of their unpainted minis and just increase my purchases of other brands since part of the appeal for the Wizkids minis for me was having the bases included.

[berk the black]

I already have a bin full of bases, which I use for various reasons. Switching from transparent to black is one, but changing base size to better suit the mini is another. Downsizing sphinxes to large bases, and increasing Formorians to huge bases are perfect examples.. I’ve even taken draft horses off their legitimate large bases and put them on pill bases so that they could fit side by side when pulling a wagon. The point is, I’ve needed to switch out bases even though they were provided many times. So having to do so for some more just isn’t that big of a deal to me. Especially now that clear bases seem to be the default, which is simply unacceptable to me. To this end, I have already hunted down plenty of spare bases and look at this as expected maintenance.

But for those collectors who didn’t object to the base color change (I’m guessing the vast majority), this does seem like a step backwards. As much as I dislike skateboards on a mini at all, I like them even less without bases.

[Clint]

Including no base screws everyone over and helps no one.

If all you mean by "screwing everyone over" is that people who were satisfied with the included bases now have to spend an extra $0.35 on an aftermarket base that their preferences.... then sure. Those devils.

But for those of us (of which there are many) who never used the wafer thin biscuits (for any number of reasons), you have to understand that the intense language over this feels a little silly. I'm sorry your Flail Snail didn't come with a base if you expected one, that's probably annoying.

Yes, it's annoying for a miniatures line that has always previously included bases, like most every other miniature line does, to suddenly stop, while also trying to sell me the bases separately. And while I could easily afford to buy some of their bases, I'm not going to because they are nickel and diming me, it pisses me off, and they are already skating by on their frequently substandard miniatures (and definitely substandard plastic) by virtue of having an official license that doesn't mean much to me.

To me, this is the straw. If they aren't even going to provide me a base anymore, then I am happy to give the little money that I still spend on WK to their competitors.

[MyriadTabletop]

Yes, it's annoying for a miniatures line that has always previously included bases, like most every other miniature line does, to suddenly stop, while also trying to sell me the bases separately. And while I could easily afford to buy some of their bases, I'm not going to because they are nickel and diming me, it pisses me off, and they are already skating by on their frequently substandard miniatures (and definitely substandard plastic) by virtue of having an official license that doesn't mean much to me.

I hear you, really. But in essence the Wizkids announcement of new Bases just breaks down to:

Wizkids is no longer including crummy little bases in with their unpainted miniatures, and instead will separately sell thicker, higher quality bases in bulk packs in two color options. This distribution is preferable to some customers, frustrating to others, and many customers probably won't even care or notice. Regardless, the choice to make the change was all-but guaranteed to be profit driven.

Anything else? Nope. That's pretty much covers it.

So I guess for me the intense and hyperbolic language surrounding this issue just reminds me of why I made this thread. None of it adds anything to the discourse of the Topic, because it's clear it's not about the Bases anymore.

I'm absolutely happy to have the conversation about what this means for people who like the biscuits, or whose FLGS is likely to unstock the new bases, or about the difficulty in sourcing irregular sizes. That's all really good discussion. But equally valid are the indifferent or positive replies towards the change, and that being on that side doesn't make someone a Wizkids apologist either.

I guess I'd just as rather see the remainder of the life of this thread focus on the availability of the new bases, the implications for long time painters, viable alternatives, or anything that could help the community given the new packaging, as opposed to it devolving into the airing of grievances towards Wizkids™ writ large. Your feelings are valid, but we've kind of already got a place for that.

[berk the black]

… Wizkids is no longer including crummy little bases in with their unpainted miniatures, and instead will separately sell thicker, higher quality bases in bulk packs in two color options. This distribution is preferable to some customers, frustrating to others, and many customers probably won't even care or notice. Regardless, the choice to make the change was all-but guaranteed to be profit driven. …

Wait. I must have missed something here. I thought the base packs would still be the same old thin bases that used to come with the unpainted minis. I need to go back and read whatever we have about them, because I totally missed the part about them being thicker.

<Re-reads thread> It looks like thicker bases might be speculation at this point… The images on page one could be thicker, but with the round edges I’m betting they are the same old thin wafers. Thicker bases would be interesting, but not for minis with skateboards, which is like all of them in the unpainted line….

And just to add fuel to the fire, I just got two premium figure halflings. If bases hadn’t come with them I don’t know what I would have done (even though I will end up painting them black), I don’t have any small bases.

[MyriadTabletop]

<Re-reads thread> It looks like thicker bases might be speculation at this point… The images on page one could be thicker, but with the round edges I’m betting they are the same old thin wafers. Thicker bases would be interesting, but not for minis with skateboards, which is like all of them in the unpainted line….

Looks like they're the same. That's disappointing.

"These sleek, ultra low profile bases will add a new dimension to your miniatures without making them unnecessarily bulky!

Did you lose the base that come with one of your miniatures? Do you want to put a miniature that didn't come with a base on one? If you answered "yes!" to either or those questions, this line of miniatures bases by WizKids is for you!"

I do agree though that they should make each of their standard sizes available, however. Especially if they're advertising them for people who may have lost theirs.

[Imbalance]

Maybe we should have a separate topic for telling people what they should or shouldn't post as an additional means of preventing topic clutter. It would also be useful for making it even easier to ignore certain posters.

[MyriadTabletop]

Maybe we should have a separate topic for telling people what they should or shouldn't post as an additional means of preventing topic clutter. It would also be useful for making it even easier to ignore certain posters.

Feel free to take the lead on that. In the meantime, people will continue to post whatever they like and I'll continue advocating that it's best if the same-ole' unnecessary, emotional, repetitive, and off-topic generic Wizkids bashing doesn't clog the feed. Cool? Cool.

I just got the flail snail for X-mas. The miniature is fantastic. No base, and I don't have an extra huge base.

Friction aside, the offer for me to send you a few 3" clear acrylic bases is still open. I always keep plenty of sheets of material on-hand. We don't have to agree on everything, but if you're struggling finding options for big bases I'm happy to help.

I don’t have any small bases.

I think I've got a bunch 20mm small black bases I could mail out as well. I bought most of the Premium line, so any Halflings or Gnome small bases are probably kicking around. It's an 80% chance that I didn't recently chuck the little ziplock with them all, and I certainly won't use those goofy black things .

[Brophy]

Ugh 20mm small bases are a pain to get. Never throw them away.